Courtney B. Vance on Clint Eastwood, 12 Angry Men, and how he almost missed The Hunt For Red October

The actor: Courtney B. Vance didn’t spend his childhood dreaming of pursuing a career in acting, but as soon as he discovered that it was the right path for him to follow, he promptly made the most of it. After starting his career in the theater, he made the jump in front of the camera, doing a bit of TV work before cementing himself in the public eye with his performance in his first feature film, the 1987 Vietnam War drama Hamburger Hill. While he’s certainly continued to maintain a steady stream of work on the big screen, Vance has also been a TV staple, including a five-year run on Law & Order: Criminal Intent as well as an arc on ER with his real-life wife, Angela Bassett. Vance is now back on the small screen again, starring in the second season of the drama 61st Street, which—despite filming two seasons back to back for AMC—was canceled by the network. Thankfully, The CW rescued the series, providing viewers with an opportunity to see how Franklin Roberts’ story continues and—if we’re really lucky— maybe get to see it expand into a third season. 61st Street (2022-present)—“Franklin Roberts”The A.V. Club: First and foremost, it's fantastic news that they found a home for season two of the series.Courtney B. Vance: Yeah, we're eternally thrilled and grateful. We were a family. It was a lot of work, being in Chicago through seasons. [Laughs.] The winter, the fall, the summer, the spring... Being there for that long, doing 16 episodes, whatever city you're in becomes your little second home, which is what it was. But my family came and visited one or two times. So, yeah, it was a journey, but we were a family.AVC: How did you find your way into the project in the first place? Did they reach out to you?CBV: Yes, they reached out to me, and then I sat down with Peter Moffat and Jay Shanks - Jay was the showrunner, Peter Moffat was the creator of the series - just to make sure we were all on the same page. We were, and it became very simple for me and easy for me to say "yes." AVC: Not that I want any spoilers for season two, but did they lay out the full storyline of both seasons before you signed on?CBV: No, they didn't. But I was still in. I wanted to go on this journey with this character and these gentlemen and Alana Mayo, another of the executive producers. You do what you can, and the rest of it is fate. I trusted these two gentlemen and Alana Mayo, so I said, "Let's go!"AVC: What, if anything, can you say about what to expect during season two?CBV: More of the same. Franklin's dealing with his health and trying to help people and trying to keep his family together. He promised his wife he would retire and that Franklin would help take care of their son, who is 16 and on the spectrum, and she would get out into the world, because she's been home taking care of him for 16 years. So it was her time. And it was my time to come home. And then life happened. So our family was very impacted, she was very upset about it, and...we'll see where they end up! I mean, you'll see. I know. [Laughs.] But you'll see where they end up!First Affair (1983)—“Male Student”AVC: We try to go as far back in an actor's filmography as we possibly can, and based on IMDb, your first on-camera role would appear to have been as a male student in First Affair.CBV: Oh, wow. [Hesitates.] First Affair, that was the name of the show?AVC: Yeah, it was a TV movie with Loretta Swit.CBV: Oh, wow...AVC: Does that not sound familiar? Maybe it's wrong!CBV: No, that's right. I played a male student. First Affair... Wow, okay, cool. [Laughs.] You know, the furthest back I can remember is a soap opera. I pushed a gurney, and I think I had...a line? Five lines? I don't know if it was As the World Turns or All My Children or whatever, but I was an orderly or something like that. AVC: How did you find your way into acting in the first place? Did you grow up with an interest in pursuing it?CBV: No, I didn't know anything about it. I went to college, and I didn't know what I wanted to do, and all I knew was that I was not going to settle. I wanted to find something that made me happy, and I said, "All the jobs are not in these job books." But this was at a time when you didn't have the internet. And when I went to college, they had an Office of Career Services, but they had 3" x 5" cards, and there were people's phone numbers on them, and... they were no good. So you couldn't really get in touch with alumni to actually ask what they do and ask, "Can I shadow you?" or whatever.So I ran track my first year and...it wasn't fun anymore. I ran track in high school and played football and basketball in high school, but it wasn't fun anymore. And I wasn't doing what I said I would do, which was meet people. So I finished my last hurdle at the end of my freshman year, came back my sophomore year and started doing shows, because I knew if I did a show, I'd meet a different group of people every time. And after my second show, my aunt—who came and saw the show—said, "Courtney, you should do this. You're really good." And I was, like, "Hmmm, wow, lightbulb moment here..." And the rest is history.AVC: Did you always know that you wanted to make your way in front of the camera, or would you have been happy just sticking with theater?CBV: I didn't know anything about anything. [Laughs.] None of it seemed like an option. Theater, film... Being an actor wasn't an option in my mind. I didn't know what I wanted to do. I tried an internship with a law firm in high school. I tried mechanical drawing in high school to see if I wanted to be an architect. But they weren't for me. I just knew when I went to school that we would figure it out together, the students. And when I got there, everybody "already knew." And I said, "How do you know? How do you know you want to be a lawyer? What is that?" So come to find out that, of course, they didn't know. Everybody's posturing and carrying on, so... whatever, boo. Law & Order (1990 / 1995)—“Mayor’s Assistant” (uncredited) / “Bud Greer”Law & Order: Criminal Intent (2001-2006)—“A.D.A. Ron Carver”AVC: Most folks know about your lengthy stint on Law & Order: Criminal Intent, but you actually appeared twice on the "mothership," as it's called. You weren't even credited the first time—you played the mayor's assistant—but the second time, when you played Bud Greer, that's definitely one that people still talk about.CBV: Bud Greer! Man, I wanted that to go further. I think we were supposed to do a three-episode arc, but we only ended up doing one. I was so bummed. But, yeah, what a line: I told Chris Noth, "Not only do I make more money than you, but I'm smarter than you." Something like that. And he did not appreciate that... but it was very funny! [Laughs.] Chris Noth is a dear friend of mine, so to be able to say those words to him was very wonderful. Love you, Chris! AVC: Given the impact you made with that episode, did that have a direct connection to how you ended up doing Criminal Intent, or was that incidental?CBV: You know, I don't know. That's a great question. Because it happened years later. I didn't get into Criminal Intent until 2001, and Bud Greer was in the '90s sometime, so... I don't know! But it was good. I met a lot of wonderful people. Vince D'Onofrio and Katy Erbe and the rest of the cast and crew... We had a great time. I had five years, I did 105 episodes, so... it's all good.The People v. O.J. Simpson: American Crime Story (2016)—“Johnnie Cochran”CBV: That was the role of a lifetime. My goodness, that was... I was so grateful that it came my way. And then I was so intimidated by him. I didn't know I would be, but I was, like, "Oh, my goodness..." I didn't watch any footage. I read Jeffrey Toobin, my Harvard classmate, his book a couple of times, and I said, "I got it. I know who he is. And the little stuff I miss... Folks will just forgive me, 'cause we got to go! I can't be all in my head trying to sound like him and walk like him and do all that, so... let's go! Let's jump in this puppy! The scripts are great. Let's go!" And it was the best thing for me to do. I didn't want to get all in my head about how he sounded. He was a black man just like I am. His parents sent him to an all-white school, and he had to deal with all the stuff he had to deal with to become the person he ended up becoming.Hamburger Hill (1987)—“Abraham ‘Doc’ Johnson”Picket Fences (1995)—“Warren Grier”CBV: Doc! Wow, what a death scene. That was all of our first films. I didn't know what I was doing. I didn't know what to expect. And then two people died in the making of it, and I just knew that when the second person died, we were going home. But people voted to stay. As we were going over there, we saw that the Platoon folks had just finished, and they were coming out, so we realized, "Man, we missed the window. Platoon beat us." And we knew that they would be the first Vietnam story out there. But, you know, we told a great story, too. We just weren't the first one. Doc was... Everything was about the brothers staying together, and that phrase, "Don't mean nothin', not a thing. Gotta keep our minds straight, otherwise we'll crumble. Don't mean nothin', not a thing." Yeah, I loved him.AVC: Was that the first time you met Don Cheadle? CBV: Yes! It was all our first films.AVC: And then you got to reunite with him on Picket Fences several years later.CBV: Oh, wow. Ray Walston. Take me back... [Laughs.] Yeah, I don't know how much screen time Don and I had together, but he was on there. AVC: How was Ray Walston? You clearly have a fond memory there.CBV: I do. I loved him. From My Favorite Martian, of course. But he was a very kind man. I made sure I went up and said hello to him, and he was very open and kind to me. I think he was a judge or something like that? An authoritarian figure anyway, but I think he was a judge. Yeah, I loved him. He took me under his wing and took care of me.The Adventures Of Huck Finn (1993)—“Jim”CBV